my personal beliefs about 50/50

[custodyresearcher]

"Custody... I am responding here b/c I am not going to hijack Hawkman's post."

Good... I was hoping that I could keep needling you enough in this thread to put us over the 20 replies mark anyway!

"As far as our son coming home as he does, when he isn't required to shower, eat regularly (my son spoke of an incident (his evening meal) where they went to bojangles and couldn't get chicken b/c they were closing for the night and it was too late to cook some) Our son becomes lazy because he has no restirction nor responsibility at his father's. He sleeps on the floor in the living room so he can watch TV all night. (He had a bedroom which has now become a storage room)."

I empathize with your ex on this one because I can relate to his situation. When your parenting rights are all but eliminated and your time with your children is reduced to a pittance of what it once was, then you become confused as to how to spend your time with your child. Custodial moms have the privilege of being active in the day to day activities of their children. They get to help with homework, put the kids to bed, take part in all the wonderful nuances of daily life. Non custodial dads are reduced to having to CRAM like heck while they have their children for their little visits. They are turned into "Disneyland Dads" (much to the disdain of their ex-wives). I would give anything to trade positions with my ex wife. I want to wake my kids up in the morning and pester them to get ready for school on time. I want to be there for them when they come home with complaints or concerns and need to talk. I want to be the one that gets yelled at by a teenage daughter for being too strict or old-fashioned. But, as it is, my role is to try to squeeze as much fun and joy out of life with my kids as I can in only 4 days a month. Some things like daily showers, meals served on a set schedule, and other niceties are sometimes overlooked in the pursuit of extra story time or time at the park.

Rather than despise your ex for not being perfect during his 2 days of visitation with the kids, try understanding what a nightmare it may be for him having been separated from his kids. Let him bring the kids back without having done everything perfect. Don't quiz the children about what happened at Bojangles or why dad isn't making them shower frequently enough. Just love them and do the best you can. They need their dad as much as they need you, even if you don't like that idea. Children need love, nurture and TIME from both parents to develop healthy self-esteems and grow into productive adults.

"I allow our son to make choices in his life...."

I'm sure you are a kind and caring mother that only wants to do what is best for your children.

[stepmother]

I think I'm beginning to see the confusion here. trbotina is expressing her views on 50/50 custody in a situation that 50/50 custody does not work in. Her husband shares custody with his ex and it would seem there are issues with how each of them view the other's parenting skills.
I don't believe that the situations you described would be less likely to happen with either parent having primary custody. If they have a lousy mother, they have a lousy mother and no matter how little time they spend there...she will still be a lousy mother. If she's doing this out of spite towards her ex, your husband, then she's an unhappy, bitter woman and the more you make your house a home for the children the sooner they will see that they prefer your home and family life. Children do grow up.


She is also referring to her own situation where she has primary legal and physical custody of her son with her ex. A teenage boy who only visits his father on the weekend.
If I did not tell my stepsons to brush thier teeth and comb their hair, they would not do it. They have gotten into a routine at our home of shower and bedtime during the week and at least no staying up all night on Friday and Saturday, because they will not get to sleep all day Saturday or Sunday...the weekend is a time that we relax the rules a little....meals are more elaborate and there's more time to "snack", they have to shower sometime, but if they haven't done anything, we'll let it slide until the morning.
It sounds as though your ex is doing whatever he can...
You said your son used to have a room...he's a teenager and that is not his home. Your ex does not seem to want to do much to create a home for his son that is only there on weekends. Whatever his reasons are, that's his loss. As a teenager, he's going to begin more and more to have "other" stuff to do, especially on the weekends. Your ex does not have a say on any days except the weekends when his son is with him. At this point I would say that's only because your son still allows it. That will change the older he gets.

I'd say that your husband needs to consider going back to court for the children and you will need all the luck you can get. His ex doesn't sound like she's willing to work with you to create an easier life for the children. It does not mean that she shouldn't have access to see them or be with them, but 50/50 custody will ONLY work when the parents are willing to work together. And I wish that all parents would realize this....

[trbotina]

custody, I first want to repsond to the "God given right to parent a child" Ha Ha Ha Ha... Just because someone can produce a child, it doesn't ensure that they are productive to being a parent. My ex did not perform the duties described while we were married. He left all things to do with our son to me. I do not begrudge my ex for the time our son spends with his father. The whole Disneyland Dad syndrome is his father's choice. Not once has my ex shown interest in our son's extra-curricular school activities. While we were married, my son was in the school science fair... I was the PTA person in charge. Which meant I had to be there earlier than the kids. My ex was to bring our son later. He griped and complained so much about having to bring him, our son just said he'd go with me. This was 2nd grade. I am sorry your situation isn't ideal for you, but 50/50 is not ideal for the educational/emotional/intellectual development of our son. Sure, things are more lax on the weekends than during the week. That is only fair, for children as well as adults. The fact is, my ex does not want the responsibility of his child,neither financial nor emotional, but he wants devotion from him. This is one of the reasons why we are no longer married, because he approaches all relationships this way. I know that most fathers are not like that. My current husband is all about his kids... not just the fun stuff, but giving them stability and sturcture. He does the school plays as well as doctor appointments. He's not perfect by any means, but nobody is. Besides perfection is boring and stagnate.

Stepmother, I honestly don't think she is spiteful, I think she sees the kids as second to herself. She has shown favoritisim for one child over the other. It is going to sound as if I am bashing her, but while I wouldn't socialize with her if the children were not involved, I don't dislike her, I don't really respect the choices she has made as a mother, but those were her choices, not mine. One of the children has VERY MILD mental/emotional develpoment issues. She has been described by others (not me nor my husband and NEVER infront of the kids) as feeling that that child is "broken". Guess which child she didn't want when she was trying to split the kids. It is sad. I am sure she loves the kids, she just doesn't put their needs in front of hers. My husband doesn't want to begin the drama with a change in custody. The kids are not struggling and the stress of the tension would not outweigh the benifit to them at this point. We have recognized the early signs of ringworm so we can treat early. We provide them with stability and security while they are with us.... we have no control over her actions. She has gotten better in some areas. Her moving back to NC, even if it is part time, has allowed the oldest to participate in an extra-curricular activity. We are trying to teach them the strength to stand up on their own. If/when they are ready to make a change, they will let us know. Little signs that they are building independence are developing daily. Maybe with their strengethened independance, they will thrive no matter their environment.

I didn't mean to make such a contriversial post. I acknowledge that there are extreemes on all parts of the custody rainbow. Each arraingement has people that thrive and get left out. A child deserves to have the love and support of all people in his/her life. Momma, Daddy. Step momma, Step daddy, Grandma, grandpa, Uncles, Aunts, Teachers, Cousins, the neighbors, friends of parents, each other, etc etc. When someone in the child's life cannot give the child a positive home life or self worth, that person should not have an equal say in the rearing of that child. While there are kids who can go back and forth with little effect on their lives, there are many who act out, shut down, or bounce between the two. I knew there were others who do not feel as I do, and that is their choice. I used this forum to vent my current frustration. I know that when I was a child, my daddy chose not have much to do with me nor my brother. While some may see this as to why I feel as I do, it is quite the opposite, this is why I bite my tounge when my son comes home stinky and hungry. While my ex has troubles with responsibility, he is my son's father and my son has a right to know him. I have the responsibility to provide security and stability to our son. To keep that balance for our son, 50/50 is not a viable option for us. The only problem my ex has with our situation is that "I am ruining his life" because he is supposed to pay child support. My husband's situation isn't as clear cut. It is more of a neglectful situation, but not neglectful enough to describe a physical danger to the children. It is more emotional. Which as everyone knows is not against the law and hard to prove. In this case we love them, build them up, and give them structure. Time will tell.... in both situations.

[stressedmom]

I love the statement...would you let your child go to a school where they changed classrooms every other week. Oh my gosh, parents would have a hissy if the children changed teachers, classrooms, etc, but to put a child through 1 week here 1 week there, 3days here,3 days there....put yourself in the childs shoes. Really do it. How would you like to live like that. I don't know of too many people that can take that kind of instabity. I think 20 years from now, when we have adult children of divorce all messed up, no stability, no sense of self, they are going to say "gee maybe we should keep children in one primary home. Seems it has messed up these people. It's like a big stupid experiment to see how bad we can mess up our kids. Let's just SEE if it hurts them...who cares...experiment. If people cared about their kids, they would want stability, not fight fight fight. Maybe its the adults that should trade homes and not the kids. That way they at least have a HOME and not a couple of stupid houses to go to. Kid yourselves people that it doesn't harm children. Logic says so. You should know by now the laws aren't too logical in many ways. Afterall, it is legal to tape a conversation without both parties knowledge. Need I say more???

[custodyresearcher]

"Need I say more???"

No. You've said enough to express your opinion that children should not be with both parents following a divorce. Naturally, I hope that you will be the first to volunteer to recuse yourself from your children's lives and show us how this brilliant plan works.

Write back 3 years from now and let us know how your life is and your children's lives are with you not in it. Make sure and detail what they did to compensate for the loss of their relationship with you and what healthy attitudes about themselves they developed as a result of your disappearance from their lives. Let us know about your own emotional and mental health after 3 years of being deleted from your children's lives.

With over 80% of all child custody cases resulting in custody to the mother, I can see why YOU have the opinions you do about what's "good" for the children. Sure - the mother-takes-all system is great! ... well, not so great for kids and their dads, but GREAT for moms who aren't mature enough to engage in a co-parenting relationship with their ex-spouses.

Imagine a world with children growing up without the companionship of their own mothers. Imagine the kind of screwed up society we would have within a single generation of kids being raised without an substantive contact or involvement with their moms. Yes, let's implement your idea. For the next generation, let's work to ensure that children are given soley to their fathers and strip all of their mothers away from them.... and then see how well your system works.

Hey, all you moms out there who enjoy sole custody of your kids... do any of you want to step up and volunteer to give full legal and physical custody of your kids over to your ex husbands and agree to gracefully bow out of their lives? Who will be first? Clearly what is best for them is the "stability" of having little to no access to you for the rest of their childhoods. You aren't needed. They have fathers who can care for them. What could they possibly need YOU moms in their lives for?

Now take my insensitive prattle and toss it aside. Here is what I REALLY think..... [:)]

1) The best thing for kids is for parents to invest more effort into forgiving each other and working to resolve differences so that divorce isn't necessary in the first place. Our system of no-fault divorce is a plague and is contributing to the devolvement of society.

2) Both parents are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights. The US Supreme Court in Troxel stated that one of the most fundamental liberty interests protected by the Constitution is the right to the care, control and companionship of their children. When parents divorce, one parent doesn't miraculously lose his/her God-given (inalienable) right to the care, control and companionship of his/her children. At least, that's how it's supposed to work. Based on natural and constitutional rights, both parents should be presumed equal under the law with equal station and control in their children's lives. A rebuttable presumption of joint custody should be the standard custody law.

3) Under the rebuttable presumption of equality in parenting, both parents should carry the responsiblity to craft, without government intrusion, a suitable and mutually acceptable parenting plan. Whatever schedule or time sharing balance the couple agrees upon, with consideration of the children's needs, is acceptable. They are the parents and know what their children need far better than some aloof court. Some fathers are not able to do a 50/50 time split because of work schedules. Maybe some don't feel competent to have so much responsibility in their children's lives. The same goes for moms.

4) If parents cannot agree on a suitable custody arrangement and every effort has been made out of court to resolve the differences of opinion, then litigation may be necessary. Hopefully the family court will mandate mediation. If the matter is still unresolved after mediation then the parties may take the case before a judge. THE TENDER YEARS/PRO-MOTHER BIAS is antiquated and detrimental to children and their fathers. These attitudes should be eliminated. Knowing that both parents have equal rights under the law, should both parents want to be involved in their children's lives then the judge should follow the presumption of equal custody and pass a judgment that respects the rights of both parents.

Shared parenting statistics collected by the US government PROVE that when fathers are granted a fair time sharing order they are fare more likely to pay child support consistently and in full. Statistics also prove beyond any doubt that the full involvement of fathers in their children's lives reduces the risk of childhood emotional trauma, teenage drinking, drug use, sexual promiscuity and pregnancy, suicide and depression and crime. It is a statistically verifiable fact that shared parenting orders REDUCE friction between combative divorcees. Both Presidents GW Bush and Bill Clinton are on record stating that the greatest threat facing our society today is the disappearance of fathers from the lives of their children. And the truth is, most fathers aren't disappearing by choice. They are being FORCED out of the lives of their children by a system of family law that perpetuates insanity and promotes the interests of a single demographic: mothers.

I believe that motherhood is sacred and absolutely crucial to the development of children. I do not denigrate mothers, but rather hold them in the highest esteem. I feel the same toward fathers. Children need both parents.

In cases where one parent is abusive, the clear answer is to grant full custody to the other parent. I believe that moms or dads that make it a practice of alienating their children from the other parent are engaging in a horrid form of child abuse and may not be fit to retain custody of their children.

[mal]

I think children are amazingly adaptable, particularly if they become used to a situation at an early age. It is adults who are unwilling to change or often seek to manipulate situations in an attempt to control access to a child or children to punish the other parent or to make sure they get the maximum amount of child support.
We have had joint custody of my stepson for the past year and the changes have been so positive and amazing that they were worth every penny. He has lost weight, gotten a better attitude, doesn't talk back to his teachers or other adults, is more athletic, misses less time from school.... When asked to write his address he will list both mom and dad's. It still makes me sick and angry to think about how my husband had to fight so hard for this additional time...months of legal fees, counseling, hundreds of e-mails.... and the ex resisting every step of the way. The positive changes in her son have to be obvious to her as well, but I'm not holding my breath about getting a "thank you".
The other day I was talking to a mom who was seeing attitude issues in her 10 yr old son. She and her ex discussed it and decided for the time being that it would be best for the boy to spend more time w/ dad. This was obviously a hard decision for her and meant that she may have to get a 2nd job because she gave up her child support. But as she said, "I knew it was the right thing to do and I had to think of my son first." ....They have already noticed a difference in this little boy. WOW! I couldn't help compare that to our situation...

[custodyresearcher]

Mal,

That's a really great update on your stepson... thanks for sharing it.

[stepmother]

*APPLAUSE* Well said!
I have to say that custodyresearcher has done his homework and more. I appreciate everything that you have added to these forums. I firmly believe that children need both parents also and with few exceptions. Regardless of whether that parent ALWAYS does what's best for the child, he or she is still that child's parent. Children do not come with instructions so even biological parents make mistakes.
What I've seen is that if the parents are constantly arguing over every little detail then the children are actually not getting the attention they deserve and sometimes need. The child does not care that dad took them to the movies or the pool instead of mom or that mom bought them new shoes instead of dad...all they care about is that they saw a cool movie or got to go swimming or got new shoes. Instinctively, that child loves both parents.

My stepsons have a home with both their mother and their father. They know this. No it's not fair that they have to be with their parents separately but who said life was fair? Children of divorce often grow up quicker than other children and that is just the way things are. AND just to make a point. I changed classrooms every day in school...I had one teacher for each subject and occasionally the subject changed completely...Didn't everyone? The only thing constant in life is change. Our lives can change at any moment, with any breath we take. Now if you were meaning to say chaning schools every week, the school system would not let them do that and that is precisely why joint custody 50/50 does not work in some situations. IMHO, it's more of a disruptions to a child's life to have one parent no longer involved than it is to have to split time with each parent...

mal, I'm so glad that your stepson is improving. My husband's ex made things so much easier on us once she realized that she and I were not in competition. The children have room in their lives to love and be loved by more than one person and it does not have to affect the feelings they already have...

[lisak]

Without reading every post here (since there are many and detailed) I just wanted to express my thoughts.

First I would never 'split' my children. If there was 50/50 custody then for me, each parent would share the time with all children at the same time. To me, splitting the children seems to be limiting their ability to have a relationship with one another as well. And personally I think that a sibling bond is as important as a parental bond. Also as in the case with the original poster, if one of the parents make the decision to move out of the living area, then they waive their ability to 50/50 and it reverts to visitation.

I DO believe that children can have two homes and still be raised, healthy and happy without minimal confusion. But in order to do this, all adults need to be able to act like adults and not be petty or try to use the children as pawns in getting back at the other parent. I know that when many children have two homes, that is just what they have. They have clothes at each, toys at each, so none of those items have to be taken back and forth. I think that when a child has to 'pack' to go see mommy or daddy, that it isn't a home situation. I believe that in a respectful and responsible situation with the adults, you share the awards (make copies and alternate turns for getting the original). Or make a scrapbook that the child can share between homes. Or again, the award that is earned by the child, goes to the home where that parent was the main one involved, like mom was the group parent or dad coached (which is a limited situation).

I just really honestly believe that if we, as adults, can set aside our bitterness for our ex's, that the children will benefit from it and learn a great deal more than if they are being pulled between places.

[momsdaughter]

I have a 50/50 joint custody situation. However, I basically have no say in the major decisions for my son and I am the mother. My judge set things up in such a way that my ex can make decisions and spend my money. I have to pay 50% of all extracurricular activities when my income is 20% of the ex's income. He takes my custodial time in the summer for expensive camps that I have to pay for. He made the decision to change schools for my son. In Court, I told the judge that I had not consented to the move. The judge asked me for "evidence". I told him the only evidence I had was that I was my son's mother and that I had signed nothing transferring my son. He then stated, "No evidence". So, I live my life as a "secondary parent" because I know the Court will refute my rights. Due to the divorce, I work 9 to 10 hours per day while the ex works about 4 hours per day. My son is a superb tennis player, but I miss many of his matches due to my work schedule. The ex can always attend. So, I went from being a stay at home mother who did everything for the children, always the one to "be there" (dad was fooling around with his girlfriends) to one who cannot be there and must do without things to foot 50% of these extravagant things dad comes up with. I've had no vacation in four years, but my son has had numerous opportunities that I have had to struggle to provide......even taking a cash advance off my credit card. For the record.......dad is a physician and I'm a school teacher. The Court awarded me 6% of dad's income, but expects me to live "like dad". I lost my house, my rights, my money is not my own...........so, some dads do win. In my case, my ex won big.

[4them]

I think 50/50 could work in almost every scenario in which the parents are capable of putting their children's needs first instead of their own.

People say that it can't work unless the parent's are capable of co-parenting their children. So what is the first thing that happens? People(usually mom) that want control start showing that it's impossible to co-parent with the other parent. The fights over stupid things start up and the conflicts keep going on. In the end one person has majority while the other has one night a week for dinner and every other weekend. The "prize" is won but the poor kids pay the price.

I have seen both sides. I have an ex that I can get along with (wasn't always the case)and the kids are benefiting the most from that. We can sit together at a soccer game with my husband and the kids can bounce from lap to lap without feeling like they are in the middle. They call their dad whenever they want to and vs. versa. We follow of papers but loosely because we believe that clauses like "other times as agreed upon by the parties" really means what it says. We have joint legal and the kids do not spend 50/50 time with each of us currently but ONLY because distance/work doesn't work out for their dad.

On the other side is the fight and thousands of dollars that DH had to spend in the beginning to see his children that he was primary caregiver off prior to the separation. Emails and phone calls from her SCREAMING at him (with the kids right there) because of nail polish, I brushed kids hair, he has no right to sign homework slip before she does, how dare he this that or the other thing. In one breathe she will say how worthless he is in front of the children and then in the next tell my SS how he's just like his father. She will interpret papers to her pleasing and has never until recently when it became a need for her would allow extra time. She is mean and hateful every step of the way. She thinks men only want 50/50 because of a lessen child support obligation and it's the first thing she will bring up. Well in my mind that works BOTH ways. She doesn't want to get less money. They are HER kids!

With 50/50 though I think it would actually LESSEN these issues. Instead of having to see her 3-4 times a week and have the opportunity for conflict, they could exchange at school and rarely have to see each other. I think Parellel Parenting is the term i'm looking for here.

You can't make people "co-parent" or put their kids TRUE best interests about the conflict. You can't make people stop intentionally creating conflicts. The whole system is really a mess to me.

[Unfair]

custodyresearch i so would like to get in contact with you for some strong advice. How can i do that?

[sandbarmaid]

I would just like to say that my husband and I are going through a custody battle right now. we actually go to court in a couple of weeks. my husband had a child out of wedlock. we have been very active in his son's life. i don't see how anyone could feel like a father should not have equal time with their children. it's not that his mother physically abuses him or anything, but she has moved about 10 times in 5 years, she got him to school late over 20 times this year even though she has no job. my husband has never said that he wants to take him from her, he just wants to be there for the little things. i don't thing anyone should be able to deny a father equal time with his child. he is just as much a parent as the mother and sometimes a better choice.

[Tuezday]

In my case... 50/50 just is not working. We both had the best of intentions but since he has remarried and moved an hour away in his new wife's house its just getting more and more difficult and the children are the ones suffering. I cannot put them in any activities because they're only here every other week. When they're with their Father they're in the car traveling two hours a day. They go home, eat and go to bed. School work and projects are being lost. Just recently my youngest sat out of recess for two weeks because her midterm went to her fathers and was never signed. I never even saw it! I had to go to the teacher in person and have her show it to me to release my daughter from her punishment. They also have been late to school 26 times since school started (august-jan) all of those being from their long drive in (minus one on a morning the one daughter was sick making the other one late when she was with me). My youngest daughter is failing her grade because of constant tardies, absences where he was working from home and decided not to drive them in, or he didn't feel well.

If he were still living a few miles down the road like when we first split then maybe there would be no issues. 50/50 can work, and it cannot work. We all evolve ya know? He evolved and remarried, and the girls are evolving in ways where their school is becoming more intense, and they need more attention.

I agree it is SO important for children to have time with both parents. With my own situation that is what hurts me the most as I'm moving towards a change in our schedule. I'm giving him everything I possibly can with ensuring that the children have a stable home for their schooling. That HAS to be the number one priority here. So I'm offering a 50/50 in the summers, every school break (except actual holidays being rotating), and teacher work days. I'm racking my brain here trying to make sure that my girls as much time with their father as possible.

My situation, my 2 cents.

[4them]

In my case... 50/50 just is not working. We both had the best of intentions but since he has remarried and moved an hour away in his new wife's house its just getting more and more difficult and the children are the ones suffering. I cannot put them in any activities because they're only here every other week. When they're with their Father they're in the car traveling two hours a day. They go home, eat and go to bed. School work and projects are being lost. Just recently my youngest sat out of recess for two weeks because her midterm went to her fathers and was never signed. I never even saw it! I had to go to the teacher in person and have her show it to me to release my daughter from her punishment. They also have been late to school 26 times since school started (august-jan) all of those being from their long drive in (minus one on a morning the one daughter was sick making the other one late when she was with me). My youngest daughter is failing her grade because of constant tardies, absences where he was working from home and decided not to drive them in, or he didn't feel well.

If he were still living a few miles down the road like when we first split then maybe there would be no issues. 50/50 can work, and it cannot work. We all evolve ya know? He evolved and remarried, and the girls are evolving in ways where their school is becoming more intense, and they need more attention.

I agree it is SO important for children to have time with both parents. With my own situation that is what hurts me the most as I'm moving towards a change in our schedule. I'm giving him everything I possibly can with ensuring that the children have a stable home for their schooling. That HAS to be the number one priority here. So I'm offering a 50/50 in the summers, every school break (except actual holidays being rotating), and teacher work days. I'm racking my brain here trying to make sure that my girls as much time with their father as possible.

My situation, my 2 cents.

I agree in your situation it sounds like it is no longer working because of the distance he chose to create when he moved. It is probably time to change the arrangement so the kids aren't suffering with their school work. He's still close enough to get every other weekend and I would probably add that to what you are offering. He could easily have one dinner a week as well. You might also want to consider instead of 50/50 in the summer, that you flip the custody arrangement so that he's primary and you are secondary. You take the kids every other weekend maybe from Friday through Monday. Just tossing ideas out there for you.